There we go.
Hello, world.
My name is Justin.
I'd like to introduce you to my friend, Erik Carlson.
That's Erik with a K, Carlson with a C. He hails from Minnesota.
And this man believes that Jesus is coming again.
And if you believe that, I think you'll enjoy today's show or today's episode, because we're going to talk about the foundation of prophecy.
So there's one God, and He's kind of amazing.
And He's interesting and He deserves our attention and we're going to think about Him just for the next few minutes here.
For a little context, I met Erik not one decade or two decades, but multiple decades ago back up in the frozen tundra of the Northland. And he was instrumental in guiding my understanding of how to present the gospel to people using witnessing tools like:
A New Testament and knowing not just the Roman's Road but knowing the Gospel of John, knowing the Book of Revelation and explaining to people how they can have eternal life instead of eternal separation from Jesus Christ our Lord.
We recorded this whole segment yesterday and it was pretty on fire, and evidently I didn't hit the record button so this is take-two.
Maybe God will move in on it and help us again today.
I felt like he was really present yesterday.
We talked a little bit about the Pharisees.
Now Jesus, before I let Erik speak and be a good host, when Jesus met with the Pharisees, we don't exactly know His attitude.
We can read the words, and I should look it up.
I thought that was in Matthew 6.
I could be wrong.
But Jesus, He kind of goads, which means to point and poke a little bit, at the Pharisees when He said, “O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the signs of the sky.”
You can tell when it's red and lowering.
You can see when it's red sky at night.
It'll be sailors delight in the next morning.
You can figure out the signs of the sky, but how is it that you cannot tell the signs of the times?
I'm the Messiah.
It's My time.
I'm here and you couldn't tell.
You're supposed to be the leaders and the rulers and you were out of touch.
Unplugged.
Anyway, we don't want to be one of the people that Jesus looks at and says, “How did you not even know that I was coming soon?”
Could you not understand that I made it clear that when this and this and this happens, I'm coming soon.
Anyway, God does put certain people in our pathway and I am super thankful and appreciative that I met Erik back in college and he helped me …
to Grow and Gave Me Space.
He asked a lot of good questions and he had good content to introduce me to.
So that's enough really of the intro.
Erik, take it away from there.
How do we approach the topic of prophecy or where do you want to start?
SPEAKER 2
Well, thank you for that warm introduction, Justin.
It's been a pleasure to know you all of these decades and I think we've been ironing sharpened iron for many, many years now and so I definitely enjoyed that part of our relationship.
Prophecy is a big topic.
I've heard some authors and some pastors say as many as one third of every verse in the Bible is a prophetic verse.
The more I spend time in the Bible and the more I read it, I think that it's much higher than that.
I bet you it's a very large portion of the Bible has some prophetic component to all of it.
And so, prophecy is best understood is the fact that, you know, God uses prophecy, number one, to separate Himself from all the false gods and all the false religions.
Isaiah 46:8 through 11.
Do you happen to have a Bible close?
SPEAKER 1
I have the whole chunk.
It's a 10.
Yes, sir.
SPEAKER 2
I got it.
The whole chapter is great, but let's just narrow in on verses 8 through 11.
And way back in our college days when we met, this is one of the verses that really changed my life when it sunk in.
You said chapter 46?
Chapter 46, starting at verse 8 and reading to verse 11.
SPEAKER 2
We're going to pretend that it's God's Word, and we're going to read it with a measure of enthusiasm.
And we're going to let the Spirit speak as to the churches.
Here we go.
“Remember this, and shew yourselves men: bring it again to mind, O ye transgressors.
Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like Me,”
Wow.
“Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:”
“Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the Man that executeth My counsel from a far country, yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass, I have purposed it, and I will also do it.”
SPEAKER 1
So there's lots to unpack on that verse.
I encourage everybody listening to this to write down that.
Again, that's Isaiah chapter 46 verses 8 through 11.
And in this passages comparing Himself to the pagan gods of the time and just saying, there's no one like Me.
I tell you the end from the beginning.
And so one of the things that God says that he's going to do to show that he's the real deal is that He's going to tell us stuff that nobody but God would know, which would be to know the end from the beginning.
Second of all, He said, I've spoken it and I'm going to bring it to pass.
So you can take God at His word when He says He's gonna do something He carries through and I think we've all experienced people who've broken promises. But when we think about it, it says “for whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved” Okay, doesn't say might be saved might be maybe saved.
It says shall be saved you want to know he's gonna keep that promise and one of the things about Bible prophecy is that it is It is faith building.
It's one of the reasons that we have faith that Jesus Christ truly was the Son of God, that He truly was God in the flesh, that He truly was the Creator of the world is because He fulfilled prophecy in the Old Testament describing of who He would be, when He would show up, and what His character would be like, what His ministry would be like, and what His work would be, that He would literally die for us as a sacrifice.
Because the blood of bulls and goats doesn't take away sin, you know only the blood of Jesus Christ takes away sin, and all that was a prophecy or a picture or a pattern of eventually Jesus Christ's crucifixion for us.
And so in starting it on this topic:
First of all, you have to understand that God is a God of prophecy.
He considers it extremely important.
In fact, just before connecting with you tonight, I once again took a look at Revelation.
I believe it was the end of 20.
Go to, open your Bible, go to the Revelation, the last chapter.
I will.
Read the last couple of verses and then what's on your mind?
SPEAKER 2
I want to do one more verse in Isaiah, sorry.
So God covers this topic.
He's kind of a self-defining God.
I like Him.
I like to think about Him.
He's really worthy of our intellectual endeavors.
So in Isaiah 41, God repeats Himself on the same topic, and He declares that He is different, He is unique, specifically in that He has the power to, over time,
and he has the power of knowledge, and he can do things that humans can't do.
And here's how he says it in Isaiah 41, starting in verse 21.
He's kind of challenging the audience, and I'm going to pause and unpack this a little bit, pull it out of the box.
I'll let you know when it's Scripture and when it's sarcasm.
I'll add the sarcasm.
But Isaiah 41:21, God... He challenges these people that think that they're gods, and he's like, no,
No, it's just me.
Here, let me show you one of my superpowers.
He says, (Now here's some sarcasm.)
If you're so cool and powerful, can you do this?
Here it is.
Show us what shall happen.
“Let them show the former things.”
Can you even tell the past?
Can you even accurately represent what has already happened?
Comma.
“And know the latter end of them.
Or declare us things for to come.
Show the thing that are to come hereafter that we may know that ye are gods.”
“Yea, do good or do evil that we may be dismayed and behold it together. Behold, ye are of nothing.”
God's like you can't do that and you know you can't.
Anyway so God's power of perception and and his declaration of time is one of the main reasons why we need Him and we should appreciate Him.
All right now we can transition to Revelation unless you want to comment on that.
SPEAKER 1
No, I love what you shared here, but let's head over to Revelation Chapter 22, verses 18 and 19.
SPEAKER 2
18 and 19, we're getting really close to the end here.
Revelation 22:18 says, “For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book.
If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book.
And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.”
So, talk about a cap on how important prophecy is, and God takes it pretty seriously, wouldn't you say, from that passage right there?
Now, let's go back to Revelation 19, verse 10.
Flipadoo page.
Y'all can flip along on your iPhones or in your paper version.
19 verse 10 says, “And I fell at his feet.”
19:10?
Yep.
“And I fell at his feet to worship him.”
This is John the Revelator.
“And he said unto me, See thou do it not”, (don't worship me).
“I am thy fellow servant and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus, worship God.
For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.”
Wow.
SPEAKER 1
So the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.
Do you remember when Peter got up at the day of Pentecost?
What did he do?
He gave a prophecy sermon.
SPEAKER 2
He did.
SPEAKER 1
All of it was about the fact that this is a fulfillment of Bible prophecy, that Jesus came, and we can look at that.
One other verse here in Revelations, and then we'll kind of get into the core base, I think, of where you want us to head towards.
I believe it is, I have it saved for us here, so it shouldn't take me long to get there to tell you which one.
SPEAKER 2
Chapter where are, one verse three … that page fell out of my Bible but it's still in there. Revelation one verse three sorry pause for a quote. “The Bible is like a shoe; you use it and wear it out for a purpose.”
All right Revelation one verse three says, “Blessed is he that readeth and they that hear the words of this prophecy and keep those things which are written herein, for the time is at hand.”
SPEAKER 1
Okay, so this is one of the only books of the Bible that tells you that you're going to be blessed for reading it and for hearing it.
And obviously the book of Revelation is the revelation of Jesus Christ, the revealing of who Jesus is and the role he has to play.
It's one of my favorite books in the Bible.
It's one of those books that I don't think you're supposed to read it or listen to it and try to diagnose every little phrase and everything that's in it in the beginning.
You're just supposed to take it every time you go through it.
You're supposed to receive what you're ready to learn at that particular period of time is my opinion.
But we talked a little bit about this yesterday and I think we should circle back to it again today because I enjoyed it.
Before we even jump into any specifics about the topic of prophecy, the first foundation that a person should have when considering Bible prophecy is that they're looking at a true Guide Book that can guide them into what God is trying to say. I come to the Bible, specifically the King James English Bible because I believe it was the gift given to those who speak English around the world.
In that it was the Bible given to me by God through the process of how we got the Bible.
It was a gift.
He delivered it.
He protected it.
It is pure.
And I have to consider it 100% error free.
SPEAKER 2
Particularly... I believe you.
I just want to chime in.
Let's put a big headline up on the screen if we can.
Is God trustworthy?
Is that kind of what you're trying to say?
SPEAKER 1
I'm just saying is that when you, unless you believe that the Bible is a gift from God and that every piece of it is true, then you're not going to, only at that mindset are you going to think that every jot and every tittle, you know, the smallest mark possible is important.
And so one thing I found in studying Bible prophecy is every detail in the Bible is there on purpose.
When He gives the age of somebody or says how many days it was before something happened, there's a reason he told us those days.
There's a reason he told us, you know, on the third day there was a marriage.
Okay, you may not know what it is when you first read it, but he's telling you that because that piece of information is important.
It's an important clue.
But if you think that, you know, there are a lot of people who approach the Bible that it's, you know, it's a book of stories handed down from person to person in there.
There's a lot of things that either got in or got out of it that weren't originally there.
You don't treat it with the same mindset of dealing with an inerrant, infallible Word of God that's going to give you insight into the future.
So anyway, I think step number one is you have to have a view to the Bible of it is the truth.
SPEAKER 2
Let's pinch-to-zoom in a little bit on that.
So you're saying that a foundational concept to approach the topic of prophecy is to appreciate the fact that our God is …
not only declarative, but he's attentive to the smallest granular detail, even down to the dots, and the crossing of the T's, and punctuation, and the numbers, and the structure, and the nuance, and the diction, and the tone, and the ambiance of all the words?
And then if we can trust Him with the language and the numbers that we can also believe that he knows everything about time.
Correct.
Even if I did not believe that, go ahead.
SPEAKER 1
No, I'm just saying is that that is, I believe, a very core principle is coming to Scripture because if you submit yourself to a text and say, what is this text telling me about
different things? Rather than you're always changing the words.
One of the things you'll learn about in Bible prophecy study personally is every words have meaning.
And if you start playing with the words too much, you can completely change the destination that you end up thinking you're going to because you've changed the words.
So I can't just...
The words matter and the definitions matter.
I had a conversation with a friend, and we brought it up again yesterday when we were talking, for example, the word “abomination”.
Okay, you can go to the Webster's Dictionary to figure out what the definition of abomination is.
You could ask Google, what does abomination mean, and they might pull up the Oxford Dictionary, right?
But probably the best place to go to get God's definition for abomination is to read every verse in the Bible that has the word abomination in it,
and see what you learn from the context of those stories when he describes this is an abomination and that's abomination and He in the Bible has a built-in dictionary for almost every major important word of doctrine, so that the Bible interprets the Bible.
For the wages of sin is death, okay?
But the Gift of God is Eternal Life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God.
Well, what is “to sin”?
Sin is to fall short.
So it's like giving you the definition.
For all of us have sinned and come short of the glory of God.
That's what a sin is.
It's not doing wrong.
It's missing the mark of perfection.
And then you start to realize, wow, we're really big sinners.
Because how many times, Justin, have you not been perfect?
SPEAKER 2
Almost always.
SPEAKER 1
You know, in regard to all different types of behavior.
All right, so we talked about in Isaiah chapter 46, and it talks about, I'll tell you, the end from the beginning.
This brings up the second point that I have as a foundation, at least for my prophecy study and endeavors, is the fact that:
The Bible is filled with patterns.
And I believe that the Bible teaches that pattern is prophecy.
That the stories contain within them a pattern that are trying to tell you that that pattern is going to play out again.
One of the stories that comes to mind right now, like when you're studying Bible prophecy, is you hear that
when the Jews were in the wilderness and they set up the golden calf and Moses came down and they were dancing and reveling and worshiping the golden calf because they didn't know what had happened to Moses.
And the end result of them is 3,000 people died.
All right.
So you have this number of 3,000 and then you have Samson, just before he dies, he asked, you know, please pray, you know, place me between the two pillars.
All right.
And he pushed out the two pillars and 3,000 people died.
And then when you get to the New Testament and Peter preached the day of Pentecost and it said 3,000 people got saved.
So the fact of the number that you have 3,000, 3,000, and 3,000, as you saturate yourself with the Bible, you start to ask the question, “Is there a connection between those three stories that are trying to tell us something?
Is God linking those three stories together with the number 3,000?”
Because our brain …
Designed by God, naturally tries to look for patterns and connection.
I'll give a much simpler one to highlight as an example.
God told us that in seven days He created the world.
In the first six days He created everything and on the seventh day God rested.
The Bible then begins to tell us that we should keep a seven day week,
and that we should rest on the seventh day.
And then we learn that Jesus is going to come back as King of Kings and Lord of Lords and rule on the throne of King David from Jerusalem for a thousand years.
And that is going to be a thousand year rest.
And then you learn and you read verses like in second Peter three, verse eight.
Are you willing to read that verse?
SPEAKER 2
Yes, I can.
I want to rehearse.
My brain is still …
Pretty fried, I mean, on what you suggested earlier.
And you're doing really good.
I'm following along.
So 1 Peter, is it 1 Peter 3?
SPEAKER 1
2 Peter 3:8.
SPEAKER 2
2 Peter.
SPEAKER 1
It should start out with, “be not ignorant of this one thing.”
SPEAKER 2
Yes.
3.8.
“But, beloved,
Be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.”
SPEAKER 1
So if you take that concept of one day, there would be 6,000 years of work, and then there would be a thousand years of rest.
And I think the Bible clearly teaches that what we're experiencing … from Adam, whether it be his creation or his fall, I'm not dogmatic on one or the other, to the end of the book of Revelation, that we have a 7,000 year story that is playing out.
And there's going to be 6,000 years of work.
And then there's going to be a thousand years where the Messiah rules and reigns from the throne of David with an Iron Scepter and the whole world is going to see what it's like to be ruled by a Righteous King.
Now, why is that important for Bible prophecy?
Because if there's going to be 6,000 years of work and there's going to be 1,000 years of rest, well, where are we on this 7,000 year timeline?
And most of the people who've studied the history and the genealogies and everything else say:
We're the generation that gets to cross from day six to day seven.
Okay.
And people say, Oh, they've been talking about Jesus coming back for hundreds or thousands of, you know, for a long time.
Well, if you took a look at related to that, we're the only generation that's even close to be saying, you know, we may not know exactly which is the year 6,000, but we know it's really, really close.
And we know that when the Bible says it gets really, really close to that transition from the year 6 to the year 7, that Israel, which has been scattered across the whole world, prophesied by in the Bible, that after rejecting the Messiah, that they would be scattered around the whole world, they'd be hated, they'd be persecuted and they'd be killed.
And then finally, they would be brought back to the land of Jerusalem, back to the land of Israel,
just about that time when we're going to transition over from day six to day seven.
Not only would they end up there, but they would end up being a “cup of trembling” that the whole world would have to try to figure out how they're going to deal with the issue of Israel and what's going on over there.
Doesn't that feel like what we see on the news today, Justin, where the whole world is troubled with what's happening in Israel?
Some liking the way that they're handling the situation.
Some are furious about how they, I mean, with the actions that just happened since last night, when we talked, it looks like some of them are saying Israel just started World War III where they just killed another prime leader of the Hezbollah movement.
And then they had that terrorist attack by somebody, you know, at the funeral.
What would you call it?
It was a, three-year anniversary kind of like a remembrance for Soleimani that had been ordered and killed by Trump and now that over 200 people got killed by basically two suitcase bombs that went off on a giant crowd of people so 200 people killed and whatever and everybody's beating the war drums like ever before and you've got the …
Well, that's a whole big issue, but the point of it is, is I'm trying to give us a general overview to narrow in why this is so interesting is that Israel hasn't been a nation for almost 2,000 years.
And now as we get right towards this end here, close to the 6,000 to 7,000 transition, they not only get back into the land, but the whole world is troubling themselves with this little sliver of land over in the Middle East:
called Israel.
And it looks like it's crazy.
And so, you know, that is very, very bizarre.
One of the other things to highlight is that when you look in that verse that we looked at, I will tell you the end from the beginning.
If you go to the very … let me find the verse for a minute.
You chat for just a second.
SPEAKER 2
I'm going to find it.
Yes, I will.
All right.
I want to catch people up because.
So in teaching,
In learning about teaching, we were taught to find gaps in someone's understanding and make sure that repetition filled in all those gaps from the very beginning.
So we tried to start and lay a foundation about what makes prophecy, prophecy.
Why is it compelling?
What's the proper mindset?
And we started essentially with the Divine attribute of purity.
So if God is to be trusted,
with prophecy, he must be trusted with His linguistic dexterity.
He must be the ultimate communicator.
He must, everything God does must have intention, purpose.
He's not the random chaos kind of guy.
He's not a confused, you know, 147 of this and 28 of those, and these numbers don't matter.
You know, we are humans.
We're very limited in our capacity to process data, but God is the ultimate supercomputer before it was cool.
Therefore, we should be enamored.
So I'm going to pause and say, if somebody's not believing that prophecy is necessary or fun or intriguing, I would say this.
Would you be intellectually tickled to ponder if it's possible that God is pure?
And if pure, then what?
Then where do we go?
So if you just assume the foundation of purity and particularity,
where that God every word and every number matters.
If you don't want to go down that rabbit trail, that's fine.
I don't know where the rabbits go otherwise, but I want to assume the best about God.
So God is pure.
And then number two, he said that God believes in patterns, or God establishes patterns and God tends to operate according to His patterns.
And Erik covered a couple patterns that God tends to operate by, which gives him some:
Consistency, some rhythm, some follow.
That's one of the keys of being a good leader is people have to know where you're going.
People have to kind of catch the pace and they have to determine, am I going to keep up with this guy or is he just, you know, way beyond my capacity.
So what's another pattern in Scripture that you're about to explain to us?
Because we passed the purity test.
Now we're going to the pattern test and I just hope people are still intellectually and spiritually curious.
SPEAKER 1
Okay, so … How do I want to say it this way?
The Bible says, I will tell you the end from the beginning.
And I'm going to give you two examples in the beginning where He tells us the end ahead of time.
So first of all, the one I'm led to go to right now is in the book of Job.
For those of you who don't know, Job was the very first book of the Bible that came off the printing press.
It was before the book of Genesis.
And if you read the verses,
23-27 of chapter 19.
19.
19:23.
Oh!
19:23.
Just go ahead and read 19:23-27.
Oh, says Job.
“Oh, that my words were now written!”
SPEAKER 2
We have to pause to say there's an exclamation point, which means strong emotion.
“Oh, that they were printed in a book!”
Exclamation point.
“That they were graven with an iron pen and lead in the rock for ever!”
Third exclamation point.
“For I know that my Redeemer liveth and that He shall stand at the latter day upon the earth.
And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God.
27, Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another, though my reins be consumed within me.”
SPEAKER 1
I mean, isn't that a powerful verse for Job way back in the beginning, who clearly articulated that there's a Redeemer, Somebody who's going to buy him back from the sin and death.
Okay.
And that he is going to stand upon the earth in the latter day.
Hmm.
Oh, I'm gonna die this time around, I'm gonna be resurrected and in my flesh,
I'm going to see Him. Not not somebody else, but I myself I'm going to see Him. How many doctrines are tied right into what he's sharing there with that, and older the fact that you know, his words were written in a Book and Have lasted
to, you know, to our time and will last until the end of this 7,000 year period of time.
So, the concept that should have been picked up by everybody who read the Bible way back in the beginning, who read the book of Job, should have known they would, they need to be looking for a Redeemer, One that would buy them back.
To redeem many people understand the concept of redemption if they've ever pawned something at a pawn shop. Is that once you've pawned something it has to be redeemed; you have to go back in and you have to buy it out a pawn or the pawn Shop owner ends up getting to keep it and do with it as he pleases. Keeps it because he likes it or sell it in a shop for a profit. Okay, we need to be redeemed because we've been sold into sin and death and
And so we need to be bought out of pawn and none of us have the money to buy ourselves out of pawn.
SPEAKER 2
And the Redeemer has to see value in the thing that they're willing to purchase.
SPEAKER 1
Exactly.
You know, the story of Boaz, I found my Redeemer, the one who is going to buy me back.
And so, all right.
So that's one example.
That's one of the early books in the Bible that gives a prophecy that the Redeemer one day will stand upon the earth in the latter day.
and that Redeemer will also be involved with the resurrection.
Okay, so now let's take a look at Genesis 1:1.
Are you going to the beginning?
We're going to the very beginning.
As most people would say, what's the first verse in the Bible?
They would go to Genesis and Genesis 1:1 says in... Is this going to tell us something about the end?
Well, I believe definitely it does.
It says, "...in the beginning God created the heaven and the earth."
and it's made up of seven Hebrew words.
And, you know, the six of the words are what basically say, in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
But there's a seventh word, which is right in the middle, three Hebrew words before it and three Hebrew words after it, and they call it the untranslatable word.
They don't translate it, but it's the first letter of the Hebrew alphabet and the last letter of the Hebrew alphabet put together.
Okay?
So it's the Aleph-Tav.
All right, which is the same as the Alpha and the Omega in the Greek, or the First and the Last.
There He is.
Do you know anybody in the Bible, Justin, with your reading of who is the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last?
SPEAKER 2
There's only One that qualifies with that identity.
SPEAKER 1
So take your Bible, turn to Revelation chapter 1 verse 8, I mean 1 verse 11.
SPEAKER 2
“Saying I am Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last, and what thou seest write in a book and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia, Ephesus, Smyrna, unto Pergamos, unto Thyatira, unto Sardis, unto Philadelphia, unto Laodicea.”
SPEAKER 1
Keep reading because he brings it up again.
SPEAKER 2
“And I turned to see the Voice that spake with me, and being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks …”
And in the midst, that word means center, middle.
“And in the midst of the seven candlesticks, one likened to the Son of Man, clothed with the garment, down to the foot, and girded about the paps of the golden girdle.
His head and his hair were white like wool, as white as snow.”
It's so awesome.
“And his eyes were as a flame of fire.
And His feet like undefined brass, as if they burned in a furnace.
And His voice as the sound of many waters.
And He had in his right hand seven stars.”
I think that was a particular number.
“And out of His mouth went a sharp two-edged sword.
And His countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.
And when I saw Him, I fell at his feet as dead.
And He laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not, I am the First and the Last.
I am He that liveth and was dead.
And behold, I am alive forevermore.
Amen.
And have the keys of Hell and of Death.”
SPEAKER 1
Okay, so in this passage here, we have Jesus specifically identifying Himself as that I am the first and the last, and I stand in the midst of the candlestick.
So
What's very interesting about that for me is the fact that if you understand the menorah, you have the different branches of the menorah.
You have the servant branch, which is the main tree up the center, and you have three branches to the left and three branches to the right.
So if you were going to take Genesis 1:1 and put each word of that verse across the seven candlesticks, who's the center branch that stands in the midst of it all?
SPEAKER 2
3-3-1.
SPEAKER 1
One, so it would be the alpha and the omega would be that center branch.
So whether you're counting from left to right or from right to left, it is the fourth candlestick that happens to that.
If you go through the different creation days, you know, one of the reasons we know that evolution did not take place is because God created the sun, moon, and stars on the fourth day.
All right, how do you evolve and have all of the things that they try to do when the sun didn't even exist until the fourth day?
Think about that, people. God is right out in the very beginning telling us that I’m calling your bluff right out of the gate.
In the Old Testament, it talks about that the Servant branch would come.
If that seven candlesticks represents also the 7,000 years, that means the Servant branch, the Servant at the Light of the world should show up on the fourth day.
Remember when you were talking about the Pharisees saying, you know, the sign of the times, you know, when it's red and lowring,
you know it's going to be stormy, but if it's red in the morning, you know, like you said, red sky in the morning, sailor take warning, said red skies at night, sailor's delight, because you know that you can look at the sky.
They should have known that the Messiah not only was coming, but He was coming on the fourth day, which when Jesus showed up as the Servant on the fourth day.
SPEAKER 2
You mean from each day being a thousand years?
SPEAKER 1
Right, and so Jesus being the light of the world, the candle, the one who stands in the midst of the candle, the candle that never goes out,
that would be the fourth day.
And Jesus showed up, you know, as we know it, at the fourth day, and His ministry concluded when transitioned over into the fifth day.
And we know Peter said in these “last days”, from that point forward, they're always talking about the “last days”.
Because you're past the halfway point.
The halfway point of the candlestick.
So you have the days past, as it talks about in the first part of Hebrews,
when it's talking about Abraham and Moses and all that in the days past.
And then you have in these last days, which would be the last candlesticks.
So, so again, if you take this seven, if you take, if you take the seven candles of the menorah, you're going to have six days of work with Jesus showing up on the fourth day.
All right.
And then you end up on the, on the seventh day, the last candlestick,
is going to be the millennial reign of Christ, and then it's over.
And then we need a new heaven and a new earth.
We've completed that pattern, that candlestick.
SPEAKER 2
So I have a pretty basic question, I guess, maybe from a child perspective.
It seems as though God likes symbols and signs and numbers and sequences.
And first question is, why do you think God likes
Patterns, Numbers, and Symbols.
And secondly, does that mean that I'm supposed to be intrigued and excited and curious about the same thing that God likes?
SPEAKER 1
Well, you kind of ask a very big question, Justin.
I think every one of us are designed differently, and we all have our own different passions.
Obviously, I am a person who loves to solve puzzles.
I love, I enjoy numbers.
I can't say that I, you know, I just love math, but I enjoy, I enjoy numbers.
I enjoy patterns.
I'm excited about Bible prophecy because I'm excited to see the King.
Okay.
And when you start to read your Bible enough and realize the King is coming, you get excited about it.
I'm not excited about a date.
I'm excited about seeing my King.
I'm excited about Him cleaning up this mess.
I'm tired of this wicked world.
Are you saying there's some problems?
I'm saying there are a lot of problems, and you'd have to be blind not to see the problems.
SPEAKER 2
Is the evil so large that only God could fix it?
SPEAKER 1
It sure feels that way, and I would say that it's only man's work done man's way only produces an evil results.
God's work done man's way gives kind of mixed results. And God's work done God's ways only produces good results; in my framework of how I view things.
But when you realize the King is coming, okay, here's another thing.
When you start to study about …
If this pattern that I've discussed with you is correct, that there's a thousand years for every day of creation, there's a thousand years for every stick on the menorah of the candlestick, and we're coming to the end of the sixth day, and we're going to transition into the seventh day, and we get to be that generation that sees that transition,
I can't think of a more exciting time in history to be alive and to be studying the Bible and to be watching.
Some Bible teachers would say there's more in the Bible talking about what's going on in our lifetime today than any other generation that ever lived.
There's more prophetical verses that apply to our life, our generation, our span of time than any other group.
And so, it definitely makes it exciting.
If you don't have a prophetical view of the events that are happening right now it could become quite depressing.
When you look at the news and everything else.
But if you understand that God said, as it gets closer to the end of that sixth day, you're going to see wars and rumors of wars.
You're going to see ethnic group fighting ethnic group.
You're going to see nation fighting nation, kingdom fighting kingdom.
You're going to see families fighting within families.
You're going to see lies and deception on a level that you can't imagine.
You're going to see wickedness on a level that you couldn't imagine.
You're going to see man create an image that can both walk and speak.
I mean, you and I like to talk about Ai and technology, but I mean, are we not the first generation that could create an image?
SPEAKER 2
My friend told me they had a concert of people that are now deceased, and they had their image and likeness up on the screen and up on the stage in a 3D model, and nobody could tell if it was the real person or if it was a hologram jumping around and singing.
So yeah, they're having virtual concerts now.
SPEAKER 1
So if we go to the book of Revelation on chapter 13, most people who've ever even dipped in a little bit into Bible prophecy have heard about the mark of the beast, you know, that there's an economic system coming during this seven year period of time where the Antichrist is ruling and reigning on the earth, where he's going to cause all to receive a mark in their right hand and in their forehead.
And those who don't receive that mark are killed.
Do you know who enforces whether you get your head chopped off or not?
It's the image.
It's the Ai that does it.
Well, doesn't that make sense?
Because who else could track fast enough to know who are the violators or manage such a system?
Oh, think about what Ai has done for requiring the Mark of the Beast or having the world beg for the Mark of the Beast.
By next year,
they will be able to clone video from Ai from scratch of you and me of things we never did and at such a quality that people wouldn't even know it was fake.
Like if you've seen the latest text-to-image generations where they're creating fake people and there's no way to tell they never existed;
but they have, you know, internet influencers that are completely Ai-generated models that are making money or doing whatever, and they're not a real person.
But they can put the clothes on when they want to, and people can't even tell that they're not real flesh-and-blood people.
And Jesus said in the last days, when I come back, will I find faith on the earth?
You know, I think a lot of people immediately go, well, he's talking about, will I find spiritual faith?
Will I have religious faith?
I think it's faith in general.
Do you have faith in your government?
Do you have faith in that video you just watched?
Do you have faith in the audio you just heard?
SPEAKER 2
Listen, is this one real?
Because she likes discernment and validation.
Is this a deep take?
Am I watching a deep take?
SPEAKER 1
So think about that.
So wouldn't it make sense if we could have some way where everybody's ID would be connected to their biology so that they could not be faked by a computer?
That Ai couldn't fake it because it's tied into your biology.
Maybe it needs to tie in on your right hand or your forehead.
SPEAKER 2
So you're saying we're getting close.
A lot of people get nervous when you say we're getting close.
So let's back it up and tie it in.
Can we go to Ezekiel and can you give us a pattern from Scripture that
indicates that God's still in control, we can have peace of mind, but that God has a pattern established for what happens before He comes back.
SPEAKER 1
Alright, well, let's go to Ezekiel 6, 11.
And this gives what I think is a mathematical formula or a sequential formula of the destruction of a nation,
and you want to read that for us?
So this is Ezekiel 6 verse 11.
SPEAKER 2
I want to tell you, I read chapter 7 this afternoon and I was really feeling it.
Oh man, it was awesome because God's going to fix a lot of stuff.
So it's a teaser, it's a trailer.
I'll maybe read one verse out of chapter 7 in a minute, but I would encourage anybody who really wants God to fix the problems in the world, if you watch the news, you owe it to yourself to read
Ezekiel chapter 7, because that is the solution, my brother and sister.
All right, we'll back it up.
Chapter 6 verse 11 says, “Thus saith the LORD GOD ”, pause, all caps, “Smite with thine hand, and stamp with thy foot, and say, Alas, for all the evil abominations of the house of Israel!” Exclamation point, for they shall fall by the sword, by the famine, and by the pestilence,
SPEAKER 1
Okay, so when you break this verse down, you realize that the first step in the formula is abomination.
So when abomination gets a foothold in a society, this would be men dressing like women, women dressing like men, this would be homosexuality, this would be transgenderism, this would be false religion, and there's a whole bunch of things I encourage you to read through the Bible, the whole list of abominations, but there are some that are very clear.
And so when that takes over in society, then the next thing you can expect is the sword.
You can expect to go to war.
God will judge a nation that's involved in abominations with war.
War then leads to economic hardship and famine.
And then from economic famine, you end-up typically with bad sanitation, bad nutrition, and you end up with plague and people die of disease and famine and all those components.
When you then see that formula and then you get over into the book of Revelation and you read Revelation chapter six, notice how six in Ezekiel talks with six in the book of Revelation.
That's another thing.
Well, some people say, well, all those numbers are arbitrary.
When you start to really look at the patterns in the Bible, you'll find out that chapters seem to coincide themselves through the Bible.
So I often find myself where I find a fun verse and I decide I want to read every
every chapter and verse of that in the Bible of that.
So let's say I find a really fun verse in 4:11 of some book of the Bible.
I find myself reading, well, I want to read every chapter 4:11 and every verse in every chapter of the Bible and see if they continually hit on the same theme over and over again.
And oftentimes they do.
Is that an accident?
Is that just a coincidence?
Being a guy that likes math, it just doesn't seem mathematically possible to hit on some of these obscure topics over and over again in the same verse on chapters.
Anyway, so God is the opposite of an accident, right?
So, um, when we get to the four horses of the apocalypse, we have the first, we have the white horse and then we, um, that goes forth conquering and to conquer.
Okay.
And that it is given a crown and it is almost in a sense worshipped.
And have we not seen abomination given a crown in our society and almost worshipped as being more important like you can get in more trouble by violating and supporting abomination … (just watch the video above)
…
I don't think I did because I'm just saying that's what the Bible listed as that.
So now the second thing that we have is that we have war and that is red and with the sword.
And so now we have the world breaking out in war and most of the countries everybody's afraid about in these wars are red Russia, red China, red North Korea, and
They have been given a great sword.
All of them are claiming to have hypersonic missiles, which travel so fast that they can get by all of the different defenses.
Russia just claimed to have put into service in December of last year, 2023, Satan 2, or what they call in Russia, Sarmat.
And Sarmat is so powerful that it can launch in 60 seconds and it can destroy France, the entire country of France, with one missile.
It can destroy the entire country, [I mean the entire country], the entire state of Texas in one missile.
Now if that is not a great sword, and if you wonder why Europe isn't freaking out with what's going on with the war with Russia right now, it's their Cuban Missile Crisis, right?
Because Russia now has a weapon that can destroy any country in Europe in six minutes.
SPEAKER 2
60 seconds to launch and six minutes to land and there's no more country.
SPEAKER 1
And so it's a scary time.
Now, I do believe that if you look later in Revelations, the whole world goes and hides underground in Chapter 6 at the end on the sixth seal.
And the kings, the queens, the bondmen, the slaves, everybody goes and hides underground.
And they say to the rocks, fall on us, they think it's Armageddon, the end of the world.
In fact, that would be their language.
This is the end, you know, they're all hiding.
And I think that's like in every Hollywood movie
Everybody's gonna go hide underground because a few cities are going to be destroyed, and as they come out from underground It's gonna be like the Sun is rising. If you've ever seen how these stories are told they they have a apocalyptic movie it ends with a bunch of people in hiding or in a boat or something and then they have a Sunrise where they come and kind of stand on the bluff and the Sun is coming up and we're basically … we need to build back better you know we need to,
we need to do it right this time.
We need to build a golden age.
And I think that's how the seven year tribulation starts.
It starts with a nuclear exchange.
A nuclear exchange is not the end.
I mean, it's not the beginning of world war three.
It is the end, but it's going to be short, sweet in the sense that it's going to take out some major components, some cities, and then the whole world is going to go, you know, …
we need to do it differently this time, and they start to build their what they think is going to be the golden age led by Ai and the Antichrist who they think is the Messiah. And it takes them about three and a half years for them to realize, “Oh I think we got a we got a false a false Messiah here and that we thought was the Messiah.” You know the Jews are looking for their Messiah right now Islam is looking for their Messiah right now;
the return of their leader.
Almost every religion is expecting this great leader to come on the stage and pull us out of this mess.
And so that will happen.
So I feel like I kind of went off on a side train here, but what I want to be saying is that this is, let's bring some hope and some happiness into what I've just shared here.
So go to Revelation 3, verse 10. 3:10.
SPEAKER 2
Yes, we need hope, sunshine, happiness.
3:10 says, “Because thou has kept the word of my patience, I will also keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world to try them that dwell upon the earth.”
SPEAKER 1
Okay, so there is a group of people that get to be kept from this hour of temptation that's coming upon the whole earth.
Okay.
And I believe that as those who have put their faith and trust in Jesus Christ, that we are going to be kept from all of these horrible things that we were talking about.
We talk about patterns as prophecy: the story of Lot and Sodom and Gomorrah.
What do we, we attribute Sodom and Gomorrah was a city known for its abominations that were so bad that they even reached up into heaven.
And Abraham and the angel of the Lord sat and had this conversation and said, Hey, if I can find 50 righteous people, will you spare the city?
And how about 30?
And then how about, and they whittled it down to what was it?
10?
You can find 10 righteous.
So how many did they find?
Four, possibly three because the wife turned back.
All right, so they say they got to get out of town, right?
The angel says pack up your stuff.
You got to get out of there today.
They were diddly-daddling.
You know how hard it is to get your family to pack for moving, right?
So they were going slow and the angel said we don't have any time left.
Grabs the two daughters by the hand, the husband and wife by the hand, and they set them outside the city.
So this is a picture of what we call the rapture in the Old Testament.
They literally grabbed those four individuals.
The angel literally set them outside the city.
So they basically teleported them outside the city and set them down.
Now, escape up into the mountains, which is symbolic of escape up into Heaven, right?
Up to the mountain.
And so the word escape is used a whole lot of times in there.
And angel says, because we can't, we can do nothing to the city until you're gone.
So even to the fact that God agreed at 10, he really wouldn't do anything until there was zero.
So go to Luke chapter 17.
SPEAKER 2
I love the God who protects me, because that's proof that He loves me.
SPEAKER 1
Go back to Luke chapter 17 and go back.
Start at the last verse in the chapter and scan your way forward.
SPEAKER 2
Yeah.
SPEAKER 1
Until you see, as in the days of Noah and Lot.
SPEAKER 2
“And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord?
And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.”
SPEAKER 1
Okay, so you read the last verse.
What I wanted to do is go back to verse 25 and read that to the end.
And I think we can wrap it up for here.
SPEAKER 2
Yep.
Sorry, I'm going to back up to the middle of verse 24.
“So shall also the Son of Man be in His day.
But first He must suffer many things and be rejected of this generation.
And as it was in the days of Noe, [which is Noah], so shall it be also in the days of the Son of Man.
They did eat and drank and married wives.
They were given in marriage until the day that Noe entered into the ark and the flood came and destroyed them all.
Likewise, also, as it was in the days of Lot, they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded.
But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom, it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.”
Same day.
“Even thus shall it be in the days, in the day, when the Son of Man is revealed.
In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away.
And he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.
Remember Lot's wife.”
Wow.
SPEAKER 1
Keep going.
So we can just pause right there.
So Jesus obviously is highlighting that the last days that there is a pattern in the story of Noe and a pattern in the story of Lot that we need to learn because this last day's event is going to be very similar.
And let's just look at verse 29.
But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom, it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all.
So I believe that, let's say, some believe that New York is modern day economic Babylon, right?
And then we read in Revelation 18 that Babylon gets destroyed in a day, right?
I believe that the rapture or the catching away of the
saved individuals from New York and the rest of the world happen on the same day that, in that case, would be destroyed.
Because on the “same day” that Lot went out of Sodom, fire and brimstone fell.
And so, let's go over to Revelation chapter 18.
I know we're landing on this example of Lot pattern at the end here.
And I'm sharing this in regard to hope.
The Bible says, pray that thou be worthy to escape, after he's talking about all of these things that are coming upon the earth.
And our Blessed Hope is that glory of appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, when we get to escape these things.
And when all of the other gospels are talking about wars and rumors of wars and earthquakes, famine, pestilence, all those things that are common when people are talking about the end times,
The Gospel of John doesn't cover that story.
Instead, the Gospel of John says, “I go to prepare a place for you, and if I go to prepare a place for you, I will come again and,” you know, where I am here will be also in my Father's house or many mansions.
If it wasn't so, I would have told you.
And so John's story, which is in the same timeline of all those other stories, is that you're going to be taken home for a marriage.
At the same time everybody else is going to be going through this great time of testing.
But look at Revelation 18 and read verse 4.
SPEAKER 2
Wow, that's like the only positive point of light in the whole chapter.
I was just skimming it before, like, where is he going to find any hope and happiness in Revelation 18?
But there it is in verse 4.
“And I heard another voice from heaven saying, Come out of her, My people, that you be not partaker of her sins and that you receive not of her plagues.”
SPEAKER 1
Okay, so before the destruction happens, He calls His people out.
And I could give you multiple examples where this takes place.
It's a repeating pattern.
And so,
So it's part of the character of God.
It's part of the character of God.
And, you know, there is a hedge of protection that's on a city because it has righteous people.
When I say righteous, righteous in the fact that they're covered in the blood of the Lamb, that they've been saved by Jesus Christ.
And in certain situations, horrible things can't happen until they're removed.
This also leads to me to believe that most likely the destruction of the city of Damascus is going to happen after the rapture because of the fact that it is one of the oldest Christian cities.
It's the oldest ancient city still functioning today is Damascus.
SPEAKER 2
And we'll have to cover the destruction of Damascus prophecy on the next clip.
But all right, let's summarize what we got so far, and then let's pray it out.
You want to take us down from the top and give us a little, or do you want me to do it?
SPEAKER 1
Well, the whole purpose of this call right here was hopefully just to light a spark into you that the Bible tells us the end from the beginning, that there's all kinds of clues in the Bible that talk about the generation that we live in right now.
And I believe that the Bible clearly seems to indicate that we are the transitionary generation that gets to see us go from the sixth day to the seventh.
And so the Bible calls us to watch and
It's one of the things I think that makes the Bible the most exciting book ever.
Not only is it a love story from God, but the fact that He made it a mystery book, you know, with clues and adventure and it's fresh and exciting.
You can go to it all the time because, I mean, if all you're reading the Bible for is to find the do's and don'ts, it can get pretty boring.
You know, read some of the Old Testament where all it talks is about of the rules of how to do the ceremonial stuff.
That'll wipe you out, right?
Or the genealogies.
But if you're reading the Bible for wisdom and clues, I wanted to cover this and I'll be, I'll land with this is saying that, knowledge is to know what something, I wrote it down here so I wouldn't mess it up.
Knowledge is to know what happens.
Understanding is to know why it happened.
But wisdom is to know what to do when it's happening.
And so if you want wisdom, you're going to get wisdom by understanding the patterns in the Bible.
So when you see that pattern playing out, even in your own life, maybe in your work relationships or your family relationships or the things that are going on around you, like, hey, I've heard, I've seen this story before.
I Know What I'm Supposed to Do in this Situation, How I'm Supposed to Act.
That's wisdom.
And there's nothing more precious than wisdom.
So all of that is, fall in love with the Bible and it will pay great dividends of hope and happiness and the ability to smile when everybody else has nothing to do but grump.
SPEAKER 2
So join Team Jesus, because the alternative is not awesome.
Well said.
Alrighty, got to wrap it up.
SPEAKER 1
Why don't you pray and wrap up the night, Justin?
SPEAKER 2
Dear God, thank you for loving us enough to communicate, give us a clean Book.
Thank you for being a good Father, a good Guide, a good Teacher.
Thank you for giving us capacity to understand You slightly.
Thank you for being a God of mystery and intrigue and mathematics and English and language and science and power and justice and reconciliation and
fixing stuff and we know the world needs a lot of fixing.
We basically just need you to come back and resolve this because we're beyond our capacity to comprehend how any of it can be fixed at this point.
Spiritually, financially, emotionally, relationally, there's just so we're all stretched to the snapping point and we need a great God …
Who has provided great salvation to now come and provide great rescue from this world of sin and strife.
So, dear Jesus, even so, Lord Jesus, come quickly.
Amen.”
Thanks for watching, folks.
Tune in again next week or whenever we do this again.
Who knows?
If you could like and comment, that really helps break-through the algorithm and share it with the world. Thank you.
Purity, Patterns, and a Safe Approach to Prophecy